[GLLUG] RE: linux-user Digest, Vol 5, Issue 14
Lachniet, Mark
mlachniet at sequoianet.com
Wed Sep 17 14:33:20 EDT 2003
Hello all,
I will second what Ken Kousky says about the Linux certification
programs. In a way, I'm glad to see SAIR gone, as it narrows the
vendor-agnostic field down to LPI and the CompTia Linux stuff. The
Blue/Green SAIR linux books were really great training materials, but
too many choices is not a good thing, especially in an emerging market.
Ken is also very right that it is all about marketing - and really about
support, IMO. Until open source stuff gets "mainstream support" such as
vendor backing and a solid, hopefully certified, workforce it will be
relegated to geekdom. IBM has obviously helped a LOT with their
efforts. BTW, for an interesting read on this movement into the
mainstream, try looking into the idea of "disruptive technology" and
open source. There are some interesting articles on the topic,
including one at http://www.iunknown.com/000226.html. If anyone is
*really* interested in the topic, I have a presentation about it at
http://lachniet.com/powerpoint/. The presentation is called
"2003-09-10-SIM-DisruptiveTechnologyAndOpenSource.ppt". The average
google search will turn up some other interesting articles for you
eclectics out there.
Anyway, back to LPI - I highly recommend that everyone with even a
little time to spare get on the LPI listserves (they currently have
about 0 traffic) and see if they can help. It is a great learning
experience, and you get a chance to be involved in something really
interesting and useful for society. Every now and then you can also get
a paying $$ gig with them for item review, etc. so its not always
volunteer work. http://www.lpi.org. You also get the honor (and
ethical responsibility) of seeing all the test questions ahead of time,
so if you were a teacher that would really help you to formulate your
curriculum.
Cheers,
Mark Lachniet, Sr. Security Engineer
CISSP, MCNE, MCSE, CCSE, LPIC-1, TICSA
Analysts International
(517) 336-1004 (voice)
(517) 336-1100 (fax)
mailto: mlachniet at analysts.com
Message: 6
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 09:48:09 -0400
From: "ken kousky" <kkousky at ip3inc.com>
Subject: [GLLUG] some more thoughts on Linux certifications - they
need your help
To: "'Pedro Wald'" <wald at ispwest.com>, <linux-user at egr.msu.edu>
Cc: Karen Letain <kletain at ip3inc.com>
Message-ID: <000001c37d22$552257e0$c301a8c0 at ROADWARRIOR>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
First, the question about the Sair cert - When I was CEO of Wave
Technologies, a NASDQ listed public company, we acquired the Sair Linux
company. This was 1999 or 2000. We shared much of the exam, focus and
content with CompTIA and helped sponsor the Linux+ Certification. We
also worked with the Linux Professional Institute (LPI) where I served
on their advisory board for several years. The exams still live but the
market interest has waned. It's future is up to the community.
Our goal was to promote the professionalizaton of Linux. I know, lots of
people scream when I use this term. First of all it's not really a word
but the bigger issue is it implies that Linux, even with the likes of
IBM peddling it, still needs assistance in establishing itself as a
"professional" platform.
This is not a technical knock, it's a marketing issue.
In 2000 Thompson acquired Wave and decided they did not want to support
these efforts to help professionalize the Linux market and closed the
Sair operations. Eventually, most of the intellectual property was
reassembled by some of the Linux support group out of Compaq.
There is still a lot of work to be done to bring the Linux market to the
level of professionalism seen in the Microsoft channels. I believe this
is a vital process that needs to be addressed.
I drafted a white paper while President of Netware Centers International
(Novell's sales and distribution company in the mid 80's). At the time
we only sold NetWare through small independent resellers. In order to
give them the professional credibility they needed with their clients,
we needed something to endorse them. We needed to document their
credibility. They needed to be bigger than "Ken's Computers and Bagels"
to establish comfort and confidence with the clients. Remember, we were
selling against the likes of Wang, DEC, Data General, Control Data, etc.
(please note, they're all gone now!)
So, my long winded message from an old-timer. These certifications take
time, they need helping hands to influence scope and coverage but they
can server as vital tools to create a credible network of programmers,
developers and integrators and offer the market a seal of good
housekeeping.
These certifications are really what you make them and there is a great
opportunity for some of the lugs to take active and supportive roles in
this process.
Good luck with it.
KWK
-----Original Message-----
From: linux-user-request at egr.msu.edu
[mailto:linux-user-request at egr.msu.edu]
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 12:00 PM
To: linux-user at egr.msu.edu
Subject: linux-user Digest, Vol 5, Issue 14
Send linux-user mailing list submissions to
linux-user at egr.msu.edu
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://www.egr.msu.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-user
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
linux-user-request at egr.msu.edu
You can reach the person managing the list at
linux-user-owner at egr.msu.edu
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of linux-user digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Which distribution for Oracle server? (Jeremy Schneider)
2. Re: linux-user Digest, Vol 4, Issue 6 (Pedro Wald)
3. About Apache fp Extensions (aenic)
4. Registering on MSU Network / Wireless question (Thomas Alan Hearn)
5. RE: Registering on MSU Network / Wireless question (Melson, Paul)
6. some more thoughts on Linux certifications - they need your
help (ken kousky)
7. Re: Registering on MSU Network / Wireless question (Dylan M.)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 2003 13:22:40 -0400
From: "Jeremy Schneider" <jer1887 at asugroup.com>
Subject: Re: [GLLUG] Which distribution for Oracle server?
To: <imetis at imetis.com>
Cc: linux-user at egr.msu.edu
Message-ID: <sf60772d.020 at GWIA>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
> Hello,
> My organization will soon be upgrading our Oracle servers (currently
8i on NT 4), and I have convinced them
> that Linux is the way to go for the new OS. I'm currently researching
which distribution would be the best. These
I just discovered GLLUG and I noticed your thread in the archives for
the mailing list. I also noticed that you settled on
RHAS. I'm an Oracle DBA and RH SysAdmin for a company based out of
Okemos called The ASU Group and I'm towards
the end of a project that seems very similar to what you're doing.
> servers(we will have 3: dev, production, web) will be dedicated to
hosting Oracle 9i. The hardware will be Compaq
> ProLiant DL360 servers, with data being stored to an IBM Tivoli SAN.
We have two ProLiant ML370's (very similar to the DL360) running Oracle
9i RAC together. We're using an EMC
CLARiiON storage network for the database with QLogic HBA's. There
were a few minor issues getting started but it's
running well now. Yeah, linux on a cluster of dual-processor 2G Xeon
ProLiants, 4G memory each, redundant 2G fiber
connections to an EMC CLARiiON storage network with a fully redundant
2G fiber backplane (!), running Oracle 9i
Real Application Clusters with transparent application failover -- I
can yank the plug from the server you're connected to
while you're running your month-end financial analysis report and you
won't even know anything happened (except for
about a 10 second failover time)... it's like a flock of penguins
riding Harleys...
> Oracle certifies and supports Red Hat Enterprise, and UnitedLinux
(Conectiva, SCO, SuSE, TurboLinux).
> I've not been thrilled with Red Hat, and have not personally used
any of the UnitedLinux versions. From the
> things I've read so far, I'm leaning towards SuSE. I'm installing
that on another box as I type, to get a first hand
> look.
We wound up going with Red Hat because of the support. Oracle's really
throwing their weight behind Red Hat.
> What are your experiences with these distros? Has anyone used a SAN
with Linux? If so, was there anything
> weird I should know about?
The weirdest thing we ran into was that the EMC sales rep told us that
EMC supported path failover (we
have redundant connections from the servers to the SAN) and booting
from the SAN at the same time on
linux, which they don't. After far too many painful hours with EMC
reps and support techs and one EMC
engineer flying in from California we decided that they did not in fact
support it. Embarrassing for EMC, a lot
of wasted time for us.
> I've been running Linux at home, in several flavors, for about 6
years, but this will be my first production enterprise
> level project. I'm sure I'll be back with more questions & updates
along the way.
>
> -- Andy
I'm amazed how linux really seems to be taking off in the enterprise.
I've been playing with it off and on since high
school but I never expected it to be something I'd get payed to know.
:) I'm on the GLLUG mailing list now, so I'll
get any updates you post to it. Let us know how things go!!
Jeremy
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 21:07:27 -0400
From: Pedro Wald <wald at ispwest.com>
Subject: [GLLUG] Re: linux-user Digest, Vol 4, Issue 6
To: linux-user at egr.msu.edu
Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20030916210114.03087cf0 at pop.netzero.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hello,
I have the so called "SAIR GNU/Linux" certification. My first impression
is that it is harder
and absolutely no focused in any distro in particular. At the same time
I have heard that
the enterprise/group that concocted SAIR (pronounced zair) are
undergoing some financial
problems. Altogether, my impression is that SAIR is more purist and
vague.
I would like to know your assessment of such certification.
Sincerely,
Pedro Wald
>Send linux-user mailing list submissions to
> linux-user at egr.msu.edu
>
>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://www.egr.msu.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-user
>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> linux-user-request at egr.msu.edu
>
>You can reach the person managing the list at
> linux-user-owner at egr.msu.edu
>
>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>than "Re: Contents of linux-user digest..."
>
>
>Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Linux certification (Michael Watters)
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 10:29:26 -0500
>From: Michael Watters <wattersm at wattersm.net>
>Subject: Re: [GLLUG] Linux certification
>To: Jeff Lawton <jeff at idealso.com>
>Cc: GLLUG <linux-user at egr.msu.edu>
>Message-ID: <3F3664D6.9090205 at wattersm.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
>Jeff Lawton wrote:
>> I was wondering who out there actually is "Linux certified" and which
>> certification you chose and why.
>>
>> Also, I have been looking at several of the different certifications.
We
>> could use the requirements of the certification as a subject/focus
for
>> the GLLUG meetings.
>
>I've got the Linux+ but I wasn't really impressed with it. Anybody
with
>a little bit of experience can pass it. It's mostly geared toward
lower
>level system admins, with some basic shell and hardware knowledge.
>
>The RHCE looks interesting, as that is an actual hands on test and
>Redhat is one of the most recognized distros out there.
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>linux-user mailing list
>linux-user at egr.msu.edu
>http://www.egr.msu.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-user
>
>
>End of linux-user Digest, Vol 4, Issue 6
>****************************************
---
There is no Darkness in Eternity/But only Light too dim for us to see.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------
GNU/Linux Registered User # 223296
ICQ UIN: 14372714
Mobile:
url: http://members.ispwest.com/wald
======= GNU/Linux ===================
, ,
/ \
((__-^^-,-^^-__))
`-_---' `---_-'
`--|o` 'o|--'
\ ` / GNU is Not Unix!
): :( Debian Potato 2.2
:o_o:
"-"
#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sun, 15 Jun 2003 08:30:45 -0500
From: "aenic" <aenic at aenet.hopto.org>
Subject: [GLLUG] About Apache fp Extensions
To: <linux-user at egr.msu.edu>
Message-ID: <000801c33342$54783cd0$d300a8c0 at aeclient>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hello , I was wondering also about the frontpage extension compileing
script... gives me the same error!!! I was just wondering if you cracked
down on it yet , im still messing around with this one. I downloaded
scripts 4.0 and 5.0 still nothing. Running RH8 with apache 2.0. If you
found out anything about what this msg concerns pls email me back lol ,
aenic at aenet.hopto.org
niC
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------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 00:42:41 -0400
From: "Thomas Alan Hearn" <hearntho at msu.edu>
Subject: [GLLUG] Registering on MSU Network / Wireless question
To: "GLLUG" <linux-user at egr.msu.edu>
Message-ID: <E19zU9J-000Efv-00 at sys07.mail.msu.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hello all,
I've got RH9 on my HP ze5000 laptop and I'm trying to use it on the
network in the MSU library. I know you have to register your computer
on
MSU's network via http://dhcp.msu.edu, however, when I boot RH9 in the
library, eth0 fails to initialize because the MAC address isn't yet
registered on MSU's network. Anyone have any idea of how to get around
this? Any help would be awesome. Thanks in advance!
And yet another question... I have a wireless card on the laptop as
well,
and RH didn't pick it up on the install, anyone have any ideas of what I
need to do? I can't get RH to recognize it in any way, however, I don't
know much about linux yet (working on it though). I don't know what
namebrand or model it is, but it's on the common install for the 5000
series
laptops if that helps anyone.
Cheers,
Tom
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 08:41:08 -0400
From: "Melson, Paul" <PMelson at sequoianet.com>
Subject: RE: [GLLUG] Registering on MSU Network / Wireless question
To: "Thomas Alan Hearn" <hearntho at msu.edu>, "GLLUG"
<linux-user at egr.msu.edu>
Message-ID:
<0FD9D979B9535D4890AE309799B6D1E54FE135 at lansingemail.seqnt.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
It depends on which model and when you bought it. Newer ones are
available with a Linksys 54Mbps 802.11g card (I think it's a free
upgrade to move out-of-production hardware). Otherwise, it's an Orinoco
802.11b chipset, which works fine with RH9 using the 'orinoco_pci'
kernel module (load with `modprobe orinoco_pci`).
PaulM
-----Original Message-----
And yet another question... I have a wireless card on the laptop as
well,
and RH didn't pick it up on the install, anyone have any ideas of what I
need to do? I can't get RH to recognize it in any way, however, I don't
know much about linux yet (working on it though). I don't know what
namebrand or model it is, but it's on the common install for the 5000
series
laptops if that helps anyone.
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 09:48:09 -0400
From: "ken kousky" <kkousky at ip3inc.com>
Subject: [GLLUG] some more thoughts on Linux certifications - they
need your help
To: "'Pedro Wald'" <wald at ispwest.com>, <linux-user at egr.msu.edu>
Cc: Karen Letain <kletain at ip3inc.com>
Message-ID: <000001c37d22$552257e0$c301a8c0 at ROADWARRIOR>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
First, the question about the Sair cert - When I was CEO of Wave
Technologies, a NASDQ listed public company, we acquired the Sair Linux
company. This was 1999 or 2000. We shared much of the exam, focus and
content with CompTIA and helped sponsor the Linux+ Certification. We
also worked with the Linux Professional Institute (LPI) where I served
on their advisory board for several years. The exams still live but the
market interest has waned. It's future is up to the community.
Our goal was to promote the professionalizaton of Linux. I know, lots of
people scream when I use this term. First of all it's not really a word
but the bigger issue is it implies that Linux, even with the likes of
IBM peddling it, still needs assistance in establishing itself as a
"professional" platform.
This is not a technical knock, it's a marketing issue.
In 2000 Thompson acquired Wave and decided they did not want to support
these efforts to help professionalize the Linux market and closed the
Sair operations. Eventually, most of the intellectual property was
reassembled by some of the Linux support group out of Compaq.
There is still a lot of work to be done to bring the Linux market to the
level of professionalism seen in the Microsoft channels. I believe this
is a vital process that needs to be addressed.
I drafted a white paper while President of Netware Centers International
(Novell's sales and distribution company in the mid 80's). At the time
we only sold NetWare through small independent resellers. In order to
give them the professional credibility they needed with their clients,
we needed something to endorse them. We needed to document their
credibility. They needed to be bigger than "Ken's Computers and Bagels"
to establish comfort and confidence with the clients. Remember, we were
selling against the likes of Wang, DEC, Data General, Control Data, etc.
(please note, they're all gone now!)
So, my long winded message from an old-timer. These certifications take
time, they need helping hands to influence scope and coverage but they
can server as vital tools to create a credible network of programmers,
developers and integrators and offer the market a seal of good
housekeeping.
These certifications are really what you make them and there is a great
opportunity for some of the lugs to take active and supportive roles in
this process.
Good luck with it.
KWK
-----Original Message-----
From: linux-user-bounces at egr.msu.edu
[mailto:linux-user-bounces at egr.msu.edu] On Behalf Of Pedro Wald
Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 9:07 PM
To: linux-user at egr.msu.edu
Subject: [GLLUG] Re: linux-user Digest, Vol 4, Issue 6
Hello,
I have the so called "SAIR GNU/Linux" certification. My first impression
is that it is harder
and absolutely no focused in any distro in particular. At the same time
I have heard that
the enterprise/group that concocted SAIR (pronounced zair) are
undergoing some financial
problems. Altogether, my impression is that SAIR is more purist and
vague.
I would like to know your assessment of such certification.
Sincerely,
Pedro Wald
>Send linux-user mailing list submissions to
> linux-user at egr.msu.edu
>
>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://www.egr.msu.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-user
>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> linux-user-request at egr.msu.edu
>
>You can reach the person managing the list at
> linux-user-owner at egr.msu.edu
>
>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>than "Re: Contents of linux-user digest..."
>
>
>Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Linux certification (Michael Watters)
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 10:29:26 -0500
>From: Michael Watters <wattersm at wattersm.net>
>Subject: Re: [GLLUG] Linux certification
>To: Jeff Lawton <jeff at idealso.com>
>Cc: GLLUG <linux-user at egr.msu.edu>
>Message-ID: <3F3664D6.9090205 at wattersm.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
>Jeff Lawton wrote:
>> I was wondering who out there actually is "Linux certified" and which
>> certification you chose and why.
>>
>> Also, I have been looking at several of the different certifications.
We
>> could use the requirements of the certification as a subject/focus
for
>> the GLLUG meetings.
>
>I've got the Linux+ but I wasn't really impressed with it. Anybody
with
>a little bit of experience can pass it. It's mostly geared toward
lower
>level system admins, with some basic shell and hardware knowledge.
>
>The RHCE looks interesting, as that is an actual hands on test and
>Redhat is one of the most recognized distros out there.
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>linux-user mailing list
>linux-user at egr.msu.edu
>http://www.egr.msu.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-user
>
>
>End of linux-user Digest, Vol 4, Issue 6
>****************************************
---
There is no Darkness in Eternity/But only Light too dim for us to see.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------
GNU/Linux Registered User # 223296
ICQ UIN: 14372714
Mobile:
url: http://members.ispwest.com/wald
======= GNU/Linux ===================
, ,
/ \
((__-^^-,-^^-__))
`-_---' `---_-'
`--|o` 'o|--'
\ ` / GNU is Not Unix!
): :( Debian Potato 2.2
:o_o:
"-"
#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#=#
_______________________________________________
linux-user mailing list
linux-user at egr.msu.edu
http://www.egr.msu.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-user
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 09:51:42 -0400
From: "Dylan M." <misenhe1 at pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: Re: [GLLUG] Registering on MSU Network / Wireless question
To: GLLUG <linux-user at egr.msu.edu>
Message-ID: <3F6866EE.8080800 at pilot.msu.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
the trick i used to get around registering my MAC isn't all that elegant
but...
if you have access to a windows box (roommate, or any other trusting
soul out there), just toss the NIC in there, register the MAC, pop it
back in your box and problem is solved.
dylan
Thomas Alan Hearn wrote:
> Hello all,
> I've got RH9 on my HP ze5000 laptop and I'm trying to use it on the
> network in the MSU library. I know you have to register your computer
> on MSU's network via http://dhcp.msu.edu, however, when I boot RH9 in
> the library, eth0 fails to initialize because the MAC address isn't
> yet registered on MSU's network. Anyone have any idea of how to get
> around this? Any help would be awesome. Thanks in advance!
> And yet another question... I have a wireless card on the laptop as
> well, and RH didn't pick it up on the install, anyone have any ideas
> of what I need to do? I can't get RH to recognize it in any way,
> however, I don't know much about linux yet (working on it though). I
> don't know what namebrand or model it is, but it's on the common
> install for the 5000 series laptops if that helps anyone.
> Cheers,
> Tom
> _______________________________________________
> linux-user mailing list
> linux-user at egr.msu.edu
> http://www.egr.msu.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-user
>
------------------------------
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End of linux-user Digest, Vol 5, Issue 14
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